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Post by bear on Jan 27, 2009 23:23:55 GMT
All you 900 riders feel free to snigger in your shafty goodness.
For the rest of us, are Scottoilers a sound investment? My local dealership is offering them fitted for £100 and I know I can knock a bit off that as well as some additional scottoil thrown in.
Anyone have any opinions that would help?
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Post by beeblemaster on Jan 28, 2009 9:52:43 GMT
They're definitely worth getting... all you got to do is keep checking they're working right once fitted.
They're charging a bit steep though at £100, when there's this item on eBay (item 360123663137) at £63 delivered. They're easy enough to fit so do it yourself.
They come with a small bottle of oil too - but Scottoil is expensive, so I use a mix of engine oil and gear oil (just to thin it a little).
But yeah well worth it, they look after your chain nicely.
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Post by cam7777 on Jan 28, 2009 10:41:51 GMT
The biggest problem I have found is the flow rate changes with temperature. First thing when its cold, you have to turn the flow rate up, later when the sun comes out and it warms up you need to turn the flow rate down, later when the sun goes down you need to turn the flow rate up again  Lubeman www.chainoiler.co.uk/ seems a good idea and its cheaper, don't think I would have a scottoiler again |
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Post by beeblemaster on Jan 28, 2009 11:17:36 GMT
The biggest problem I have found is the flow rate changes with temperature. First thing when its cold, you have to turn the flow rate up, later when the sun comes out and it warms up you need to turn the flow rate down, later when the sun goes down you need to turn the flow rate up again I only have to adjust for the cold of winter and then back down for the rest of the year, just a position or two on the dial, but that's common sense really as the viscosity changes with temperature. Got Scotty on Divvy and TDM and both behave the same. |
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Post by cam7777 on Jan 28, 2009 11:30:17 GMT
The biggest problem I have found is the flow rate changes with temperature. First thing when its cold, you have to turn the flow rate up, later when the sun comes out and it warms up you need to turn the flow rate down, later when the sun goes down you need to turn the flow rate up again I only have to adjust for the cold of winter and then back down for the rest of the year, just a position or two on the dial, but that's common sense really as the viscosity changes with temperature. Got Scotty on Divvy and TDM and both behave the same. Yep, i've seen the excess oil over the back of the TDM   |
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Post by bobh on Jan 28, 2009 18:27:23 GMT
Loobmans (Loobmen?) are pretty good and you can use straight gear oil, which is what DID recommend, though it does smell like a tomcat's pee'd on your bike.
Only trouble I've found with them is the gizmo for putting the oil on the back sprocket, which is crude in the extreme. It a) wears out quickly and b) makes wheel refitting a pita. I've heard a Scottoiler dual nozzle can be used instead (I think they're about £16, which is much the same price as the rest of the Loobman). However, I do like the Looman concept of applying the oil to the sprocket by capilliary action. Obviously I need to do some brainstorming to come up with a better idea.
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Post by amorti on Jan 28, 2009 19:52:41 GMT
I think they're awesome. Not only do they more than double your chain life, if you are like me and often forget or CBA to oil the chain manually, it will much more than double its life. And keep it looking clean and lovely in the meantime. Here's a CB-1 with an 8k old chain that was scottoiled all its life:  I use chainsaw oil which is still pricey for what it is, but apparently has the same non fling additives as scottoil, works fine despite the lack of blue dye, and is half the price of the "proper" one. They really are easy to fit btw, you can DIY. However when you think of it they're only charging an hour's labour so if you're lazy or low on competence, you might as well let them do it. |
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Post by CD on Feb 10, 2009 15:02:34 GMT
If you put the injector on the front sprocket the oil should be nicely distributed by the time it meets the rear sprocket. O-ring chains are internally lubed for life so should never need a double injector. The oil is however needed to lube the sprocket teeth. Being smaller, the front gets the most hammer so feeding the oil there makes sense.
Lubing the front sprocket needs a bit of head scratching to locate the feed tube but it does work. It also lets the oiler unit sit in the fairing for easy access.
If the oil feed is erratic, check out the vacuum connection - even the smallest leak will affect it. Scot Oil will supply new pipes and fittings free of charge.
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Post by amorti on Feb 10, 2009 18:13:49 GMT
The oil is to keep the rubber rings from going hard/perishing. That's what kills a chain; once the rubber rings are shot, the chain is basically non-sealed and has a lifespan to match.
The oil goes on the rear sprocket because if you put it on the front, inside your sprocket cover gets very very messy. Also, on the rear it's more likely to end up on the chain than just spun off. Also, that's what the instructions say to do.
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Post by m40man on Feb 10, 2009 18:31:48 GMT
Also, that's what the instructions say to do. The teeth of the larger sprocket travel less quickly, hence the oil being less inclined to flick off, so it makes sense to lube there. ................ but then again, I do like to see a little experimentation, & the idea of a more accessible res appeals to me  . |
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Post by bobh on Feb 10, 2009 19:59:30 GMT
The oil also lubes the rollers on the hollow pins, which don't have seals. These bushes aren't so heavily loaded as the sealed pins, although once the sprockets get worn they start to take more of a hammering - it's these you can hear making a swishing noise when the chain's on its way out.
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Post by CD on Feb 10, 2009 23:00:56 GMT
I read the same stuff, but its plain wrong. Unless the chain is stretching, the teeth of both sprockets must travel at exactly the same speed. Just like gears, the rear sprocket being larger turns more slowly then the front, but the radial speeds (and forces to spread the oil) are identical. I called the Scot Oil tech bloke and he agreed that they had it wrong and although they had not tried feeding the front sprocket he could see no reason why it should not work.
The snag with over-lubing the rear sprocket is oil can get onto the tyre and some inevitably gets splashed onto the wheel. The snag with over-lubing the front sprocket is a drip under the bike, but at least they tyre and wheel are less likely to be greasy. I found the more direct feed to the front sprocket made it much easier to get a reliable flow so over feeding wasn't a problem.
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Post by General Gman on Feb 11, 2009 10:24:25 GMT
And the snag with Scottoilers is you're likely to never check the chain apart from adjusting it from time to time.
Only takes a broken sideplate for everything to end in tears.
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Post by cam7777 on Feb 11, 2009 11:32:37 GMT
And the snag with Scottoilers is you're likely to never check the chain apart from adjusting it from time to time. Only takes a broken sideplate for everything to end in tears. Unless, like me, you have a gold chain which you clean every week with a cloth and GT85 |
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Post by Fiasco on Feb 11, 2009 12:24:29 GMT
Unless, like me, you have a gold chain which you clean every week with a cloth and GT85 Chav !! Dave Ps I hardly ever needed to adjust the flow on the Fazer Scottoiler, and chain and sprocks did 26k (if a little worn  ) |
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Post by teejayexc on Feb 11, 2009 14:06:10 GMT
The snag with over-lubing the front sprocket is a drip under the bike, As opposed to the drip on top of it? |
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Post by General Gman on Feb 11, 2009 14:55:22 GMT
And the snag with Scottoilers is you're likely to never check the chain apart from adjusting it from time to time. Only takes a broken sideplate for everything to end in tears. Unless, like me, you have a gold chain which you clean every week with a cloth and GT85 I got me a gold one too, and give it a good going over with ACF50 every week. |
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Post by amorti on Feb 11, 2009 18:10:54 GMT
And the snag with Scottoilers is you're likely to never check the chain apart from adjusting it from time to time. Only takes a broken sideplate for everything to end in tears. Seriously - what odds you'd spot a broken inner side plate on a chain anyway, with or without a scottoiler? Bear in mind for most people chain maintenance is a squirt from a can of lube quickly applied once every whenever, and a clean of it with wd40 and a rag once every blue moon. Your point is invalid. Unless, like me, you have a gold chain which you clean every week with a cloth and GT85 Like this?  |
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Post by bobh on Feb 11, 2009 20:12:17 GMT
Sorry to disagree with you CD, but the centrifugal fling on the front sprocket will be greater than that on the rear in direct proportion to their diameters. Radial acceleration is proportional to V squared upon R - V is, as you say, the same at both ends but R is different.
In the limit, if R = infinity (a ruddy great wheel, for all you engineers out there), there would be no centrifugal force at all.
Think on - Bob
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Post by teejayexc on Feb 11, 2009 20:53:39 GMT
Sorry to disagree with you CD, but the centrifugal fling on the front sprocket will be greater than that on the rear in direct proportion to their diameters. Radial acceleration is proportional to V squared upon R - V is, as you say, the same at both ends but R is different. In the limit, if R = infinity (a ruddy great wheel, for all you engineers out there), there would be no centrifugal force at all. Think on - Bob But, but, but...the Scottoiler bloke got it wrong....CD said so |
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Post by General Gman on Feb 11, 2009 23:31:26 GMT
And the snag with Scottoilers is you're likely to never check the chain apart from adjusting it from time to time. Only takes a broken sideplate for everything to end in tears. Seriously - what odds you'd spot a broken inner side plate on a chain anyway, with or without a scottoiler? Bear in mind for most people chain maintenance is a squirt from a can of lube quickly applied once every whenever, and a clean of it with wd40 and a rag once every blue moon. Your point is invalid. Unless, like me, you have a gold chain which you clean every week with a cloth and GT85 Like this? Invalid, eh ? thing is, that's exactly how I found I had a broken sideplate on my chain.I have no doubt that scottoilers do extend the life of a chain (indeed, I had a VFR750 fitted with one - I took it off because I like to keep an eye on things), but they don't negate the need for basic chain maintenance..How many people with scottoilers actually check the condition of their chain ? just because it doesn't need adjusting doesn't necessarily mean it's in good nick. Surely checking a chain is as important as checking the state of tyres, brakes etc. ? |
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Post by CD on Feb 11, 2009 23:38:30 GMT
Sorry to disagree with you CD, but the centrifugal fling on the front sprocket will be greater than that on the rear in direct proportion to their diameters. Radial acceleration is proportional to V squared upon R - V is, as you say, the same at both ends but R is different. In the limit, if R = infinity (a ruddy great wheel, for all you engineers out there), there would be no centrifugal force at all. Think on - Bob No you're not (sorry that is).  Yep makes sense, so bowing to the better maths... It follows that having a smaller number of teeth, the front sprocket needs to distribute the oil a bit quicker than the rear so a bit more R will come in handy. With a bit of luck it might keep things flowing better at low speeds. |
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